Full Transcript
0:00
Welcome to the fully expressed podcast with Karenna.
0:03
I am really excited for today’s conversation because this conversation has been dear to my heart for such a long time.
0:11
And I didn’t realize to be honest that it was going to mean so much to me until someone gave me the permission to be able to step into what we’re going to be talking about today.
0:21
I have Sophie Kessner with me on the line and for anyone that’s listening, you know, Sophie and I met in the Phoenix Path with Jessica Benstock.
0:32
She also did the certification with me and I got to just fully embrace all of Sophie throughout that.
0:40
And it was such, I, what I loved about she’s listening.
0:43
Of course, what I loved about my time with you Sophie.
0:46
There was like, I feel like you taught me such a different part to the healing because I feel like we went through different things in that journey, which gave me so much light and understanding to your process.
0:57
So I just want to say thank you so much for sharing throughout that.
1:00
And then ever since I met Sophie at the Phoenix Path and just a simple conversations, like you are just hacked with information and intelligence and experience and that’s what it comes down to like business, which is why I really like was drawn to you and all that you’re doing within your online business and really wanted to work with you in that way.
1:22
And this beautiful human also has a huge background in somatics and somatic experiencing and being trauma informed, diversity and equity like inclusion, like literally like you just have so much to offer.
1:37
And so I feel like the conversation today is, is going to be so informational packed with really juicy takeaways.
1:45
And so with that being said, hi, Sophie, you did a great job trying to, I was like, how do I get everything that she does because you do it all.
1:56
It feels like you have so much to share with this world.
1:59
So thank you for coming on here.
2:01
Yeah, I appreciate the invite.
2:02
I’m excited to excited to dive into all things and I’m sorry.
2:06
And on top of that, you’re a mom like you do in life, you have a little little nugget running around.
2:12
So if you really, you really have all a lot of experience that I continue to admire and inspire.
2:19
So thank you.
2:20
Can you share a little bit about yourself?
2:22
So this is, I guess you would call like my nerve divergency in the sense that I’ve got many things that I do.
2:29
The the best way to sum it up is I have multiple businesses and interests.
2:34
I’ve always been somebody who really loves numbers and really loves data and information.
2:40
But I also am somebody who’s incredibly deep and emotional.
2:44
And as you can imagine those things don’t always play hand in hand.
2:48
So I got into the industry in 2015 and had pretty high rating on the ace the adverse childhood experience score.
2:57
And from that decided I wanted to get into like personal development and went to university to study psychology to get my degree and a personal, not personal development, excuse me.
3:07
And what was it called?
3:08
Not lt but one of those fields, essentially, I wanted to become a therapist.
3:12
And then I got into the coaching industry and very quickly, no longer needed to be in school, no longer needed to pursue licensure because I had a full practice in the coaching space that very quickly turned into business and marketing.
3:28
Because what I found when I was working with folks on mindset and identity and beliefs was that you can have one part of the puzzle.
3:36
But if you don’t have the proper systems and structure in your business, then nothing really works.
3:42
And I had a fun oscillation between many different seasons and phases throughout my career in the last 89 years and found myself in the last three years diving really deep into diversity equity inclusion work.
3:59
And this essentially anti racism being somebody who is biracial.
4:02
It was something that really struck home in 2020 amidst all of the incidents that happened during that time.
4:09
And it was something that was really, really big and eye opening in, in business to start to see it actually come to light in business because we’ll get into the sticks that kind of over, overlies with, with the trauma work I didn’t realize until 2020 how much I had been assimilating to fit into an environment of whiteness, which is the coaching industry to be successful in that space.
4:35
And how much that had impacted me in my sense of knowing who I was my roots, my family, my culture.
4:41
And in 2020 it was a huge wake up call for me when I actually had my son because I was forced to go from being this hyper independent super successful boss babe Instagram marketer to having Children like completely on family.
5:00
And it was a very, very humbling experience.
5:02
Last 3.5 years have been humbling.
5:05
And in that, that was a big part of what actually forced me into the trauma work is I had so much that came out from the birth from what’s going on in the world.
5:14
And all of these things that I started to recognize were never actually processed properly.
5:21
And so I went into a three year program with the trauma healing Somatic Experiencing Institute.
5:27
I got trained in that and now certified it as an sep or somatic experiencing practitioner.
5:33
Yeah.
5:33
Woo hoo.
5:34
And oh, built out an agency on the side because, you know, it’s fun and really developed all of the, the systems on the frameworks because what I found in, in kind of like in the beginning of my career was ok.
5:46
Well, mindset systems need to be there.
5:49
And I feel like I’ve kind of gone from an undergrad in those two realms to my phd in those two realms to where now it’s like, oh, I understand systems and automation and structure and all of these pieces where I could have never possibly fathomed or imagined back then.
6:05
And it’s beautiful how they work together.
6:07
But obviously, there’s, there’s a lot of layers intricacy to that.
6:10
So I’m sure we’ll get into all of it.
6:12
Yeah.
6:13
Wow.
6:13
There’s just so much there.
6:16
But blood where, which, which string white pool because there is so much for you to share.
6:22
And like, I think that’s so for anyone that knows.
6:24
I mean, a little bit about if you don’t want to talk a little bit about what se I does or what se I the program is because that’s a deep three year program that you through of like quarterly.
6:34
I think it is where you guys meet quarterly and you guys are going deep into the work every single quarter.
6:41
Yeah.
6:42
So the program that we met in was a trauma informed training it was a six month program.
6:48
Se I is a three year long trauma trained training.
6:54
And essentially the difference between the two is to become trauma informed, means that you are aware and able to track and notice when somebody is moving into different states of arousal within their system and help support regulation.
7:07
You’re working with it, but you’re not working on it.
7:10
And that’s a really key distinction.
7:12
Whereas when you get into work like se or somatic experiencing, you’re training for three years working directly on the trauma.
7:23
So when you’re thinking about trauma informed practitioners, usually trauma informed practitioners, ideally, they’re staying in their lane are not working on trauma, but they’re aware that the clients in any other industry that they’re working in, whether it’s health or wellness or yoga or business, they’re, they’re aware that their clients have trauma and when stuff comes up, they can help regulate them and get them back on track in the scope of practice.
7:49
Whereas with se I, you’re doing in that, in, in that, in that scope of practice is you’re learning both the psychosomatic science behind what actually is going on in the system at a much deeper level.
8:06
And all of the mentors that I’ve had from, from the institute all continue to say, you know, it take, it takes 10 years before you actually start to really understand se and I’m about 3.5 going into four years in, at this point and I feel like I’m just scraping the surface of everything that’s in there because it is such a delicate practice in how we combine, not just the, the psychology of what’s going on with folks or the physiology of what’s going on with folks, but really starting to, to see and understand all of the different layers.
8:42
And we’ll probably get into a lot of this, of how pieces are showing up in the here and now and how we actually start to unravel and create space and capacity to navigate.
8:55
And what is the word, discharge some of that energy to start to free up more space, more, more aliveness, more vitality within the person.
9:04
So hopefully, that’s a helpful summary.
9:07
No, that was super helpful.
9:09
And I think it’s just important to identify.
9:10
So like I can definitely attest to like I am trauma informed and it has given me a new lens to look through with working with clients, right?
9:18
Like I can see what’s going on, I can say, oh, this person is having quote unquote experience and I could help you regulate and come down and I’m going directly into the trauma and dealing with and working through and processing that.
9:32
Like that is not my area of expertise that takes a whole another level.
9:35
And so I can totally confirm, I guess from the other side of the room of like what that actually means and what that feels like and I think, you know, for today, like what I really, really want to dive into, especially when it comes to trauma and how to navigate trauma is really talking about how to process anger and rage.
9:57
And you know, I the reason I mean, you were talking about this on your Instagram stories and I reached out to you.
10:03
So I was like, I really want to have this juicy conversation.
10:05
I knew that like inviting you on was going to take it to a whole another level.
10:09
But like from my own experience, when it comes to like anger and rage, like my entire life was this like peaceful, sweet, easygoing child.
10:19
Like if you ask my parents, like that’s how they’ll describe me.
10:22
I think for the most, I think most of my life, I was disassociated and like, but there were so many parts of me that were stubborn that were bratty and I felt bad about them being there.
10:32
But I never a lot.
10:33
And I think a lot of the reasons why that stubbornness or that brats or the lack of expression that I had in my system held a lot of anger and frustration and rage and I didn’t realize it.
10:47
But as I started to kind of unravel that for myself, I realized that I put on this like label of anger is bad.
10:56
Rage is bad.
10:57
Frustration is bad.
10:59
I’m not allowed to feel that I’m not allowed to show that I don’t know how to bring that up, you know, or how to process that.
11:04
And then the minute that I started to welcome it and actually express it, oh my gosh, I just felt like 10 times lighter.
11:12
I mean, obviously expressing it in a very healthy container and I learned the tools which we’re going to talk about.
11:16
I’m not taking it out on people and yelling at people, but that would happen when I would suppress it, right?
11:22
So when I would suppress it, then it would turn into like, oh, Kara is so quiet, she doesn’t ever cause conflict.
11:28
And all of a sudden I would bark and yell and get so mad because there was all this suppressed anger and frustration that I wasn’t allowing myself to process or to be with.
11:40
But most of the times because I was thought it was bad.
11:43
And so I would love to hear what was that process for you if you’re open to sharing if you’ve ever done that?
11:49
But then also how can someone step into and what’s going on when anger is happening?
11:54
You know what is going on when you’re feeling frustrated?
11:57
So I’ll, we could do a whole podcast on, on the episodes about all I know I learned a lot.
12:03
I get that.
12:06
Yeah.
12:07
Yeah.
12:07
Let’s, let’s lay down some ground work.
12:10
OK.
12:11
So where do we want to start with this?
12:14
Let’s just start with identifying the different ways that this can show up and, and how it can be brought up in a different type of systems.
12:24
So if we look at early developmental theory and, and think about like early developmental childhood and, and just trauma in general and, and we get into the intricacies of that around ages 2 to 3 is when and this is the age my son is right now.
12:40
So I’m in the thick of it is when we start to develop a sense of autonomy, a sense of power.
12:46
Now, our family dynamics and our upbringing during that time plays a really big role in how we relate to power and control and outward expression of asserting ourselves and setting boundaries and having those boundaries either be respected or not.
13:05
And depending on, on what is going on in your environment.
13:08
At the early age, we develop AAA way of responding to our environment based off of what we’re being faced with.
13:18
And you know, I’m just gonna invite y’all as you’re listening to this and you’re noticing any activation coming up.
13:23
If you’re starting to feel anything, just kind of wiggle the feet a little bit, wiggle the toes, we’re gonna get into some sensitive stuff.
13:29
So I just wanna make sure at any point any of this is starting to feel like it’s a little much, take a break, pause and go on a walk or go outside or go connect with somebody and then come back.
13:39
But if we’re looking at early developmental pieces, there are a few different types of extremes, right?
13:43
When we think about abuse or neglect, we typically think about extreme ends of that.
13:48
And we think, well, I don’t have trauma.
13:49
My parents never hit me, they never yelled at me.
13:52
There was never any like sexual molestation or anything of that sort we don’t realize is there’s a whole level of neglect in the absence of something.
14:04
And a lot of the times we don’t identify this as potentially traumatic for the system and we have to start to uncover is how do, how does that show up for me?
14:15
This is the history that I’m working with and how am I responding?
14:17
And why am I responding the way that I am?
14:19
Especially if you grew up in an environment where there was the absence of a parent, there was an absence of love, there was an absence of affection, there was an absence of emotional expression you adapt to that to survive in that environment, right?
14:36
That is the the genius of our beautiful in the systems is that we are constantly learning how to adapt and, and we are adjusting and so we learn how to survive in the environment in which we’re raised in.
14:52
And if part of that learning was well, we don’t say anything, we don’t talk about our feelings.
14:57
We don’t do these specific things.
14:59
When I get angry, I get ignored, I don’t get love love gets taken away or we learn to withhold and bring that in.
15:06
Additionally, we can see it in ways in which we feel like you have really, really big emotions.
15:13
And you know, the too muchness comes with this one sometimes when we have caretakers who don’t have the emotional capacity to support us as Children as toddlers.
15:22
And so we don’t learn how to self regulate.
15:24
We don’t learn how to be supported by somebody because we’re told to go to our room, we’re told to stop crying, we’re told to stop tantruming and we’re forced to sit there in this explosive state without really having containment or proper support to come out of that space.
15:40
And so, and in these spaces, it’s similar, it’s directed differently.
15:44
One of them is just the one of a suppression or shutting down or not really allowing the other is a turning inward and it can be a combination or layers or oscillation between.
15:54
It’s not saying that it’s one or the other.
15:56
And then on the other side of that, you know, you have dynamics where there is a lot of outward aggression that’s directed at or around you.
16:06
And these would be the circumstances in which there is not necessarily like extreme violence, but again, like there’s an extreme end to everything.
16:14
But this could be things like there’s a lot of yelling in your family, there’s a lot of aggression in, in the family.
16:19
People are really loud really intense and to a child that can feel really intimidating.
16:26
And especially if we witness harm or we experience it, then we also develop a sense of, well, I don’t want to be that I see the way that that’s impacting me or impacting others.
16:40
And now there’s an aversion to that kind of expression because our association with it is that it’s dangerous or harmful or that it’s gonna hurt other people.
16:49
So these are just again, really general concepts of, of how anger can start to develop and show up in our relationship to it.
16:58
If we don’t have AAA healthy, supportive conducive environment for developing healthy aggression and learning how to work with autonomy and rage and these bigger intense emotions in a safe and healthy way.
17:13
Yeah, under I mean, I can definitely relate to the second part of this, right?
17:18
Most of my family was really loud and even when they get loud today, like I can feel my system shutting down.
17:24
So like it, it doesn’t have to be like someone’s angry.
17:28
Like if someone’s just yelling or has really intense energy, my system tends to be like, I like going inward like I’m scared, completely shut down.
17:37
Like I’m hyper vigilant, like I’m kind of scanning the room of what’s happening and sometimes I completely disassociate and like numb out.
17:45
Like I think I’ve built this coping mechanism or way to protect myself by just like literally ignoring if people are yelling or literally turning off because I’m like, this is too much for my system, which a lot of my work has been to build my capacity to be with that intensity.
18:04
But I just felt called to share that with you.
18:07
Yeah, it’s, it’s a big one.
18:08
It’s,, it’s two things.
18:10
One, it’s, it’s developing safety within yourself to be in the here and now and then the other part is developing safety to then be out and not be in the shell.
18:19
Right.
18:20
Right.
18:20
You can literally feel it in your body.
18:23
Yeah.
18:23
Yeah.
18:23
What I love about somatics, like once you start to like pay attention to your experience, like I literally get like small and my body like experience feels so close and contracted.
18:35
Yeah.
18:36
Yeah.
18:37
Yeah.
18:37
And so in those instances, when we, when we start to talk about like se work, it’s, it’s working with that in the here and now, right, for those of you who are less familiar with this work, it’s very different than something like coaching or, or talk therapy and not that these other modalities aren’t helpful or supportive because they absolutely can be in the right context.
18:55
But when we’re starting to work with more intense responses like an actual state of shutdown, and you know, I’ll speak to this both from personal experience, but also in a lot of the clients that I work with intense freeze states are very, very, very common and especially if there’s a lot of early developmental trauma, a lot of the times you can go into states of regression where you become non verbal.
19:22
And this would be really, really confusing for somebody who’s not trained in this work to be able to track and, and know how you know how to support that.
19:29
But essentially what’s happening is what you’re talking about is when we feel so unsafe in where we are in being here and being present, we completely go into a state of not wanting to engage with our environment at all.
19:45
Now, if we look at states of, of how we respond to threats in the world, the the threat response system, the final state of the threat response is to go into a full on shutdown and dissociation.
20:01
Now, why is that?
20:02
Well, if you look at the animal kingdom, what ends up happening with, with a gazelle that’s about to get eaten by a lion while it leaves its body and it goes numb.
20:12
So it doesn’t have to feel the pain of being eaten alive.
20:15
So if, if we’re experiencing something within ourselves to where it feels so intense and threatening that we don’t feel like we can deal with the pain of it, right?
20:26
It makes sense that our system is going into a complete shutdown because it’s saying this is too much, this is too overwhelming.
20:32
I can’t handle this.
20:33
I don’t wanna feel this, the the feeling of this is too much.
20:37
Now, on the other side of that, as we start to work with that, we start to, to help the system recognize, hey, we’re good.
20:44
We’re safe.
20:44
We’re not, again, we’re not dying in this moment.
20:47
It might feel like it, that and there’s a lot that we, we do without it.
20:51
It’s very different depending on the person that you’re working with and the type of system that they have.
20:55
But typically this is a really slow process coming out of states of deep freeze is a very slow process and it takes a lot of trust and a lot of safety for someone’s system, one to go into the state, but then two to start to slowly come out of it and thaw out.
21:12
But when it does, and I my guess is that you’ve likely experienced this kind of, it is the intensity that comes after that because what is going on in a free state is because it’s the last defense underneath that is all of this mobilization, all of this energy, the survival energy that one of my, my teachers talks about it a lot.
21:35
You know, they say you have all of this survival energy that has all dressed up and has nowhere to go.
21:39
This is where we start to get into the fun work of working with things like rage or anger or aggression because now we have all these emotions that we’re feeling and we don’t know how to process them because we, we’re never shown or taught or given a space to do that.
21:54
And I’m doing a lot of this work right now with a bunch of clients in vain, it can feel really, really scary and intense, which is why there’s such an aversion to it.
22:03
When we start to touch on it, we think it’s just screaming pillows or heading things or breaking things.
22:08
But oftentimes it’s not actually the solution.
22:10
That’s not really where we want to go because we were not able to track and support somebody and making sure that they’re able to be fully present in the process without blowing into a state of dissociation in the re in the aggression.
22:24
So it’s a slow build and it’s a slow process.
22:27
And I think the, the key distinction with the way that we work with this in se versus in a lot of other modalities is that it’s very slow, sometimes annoyingly slow.
22:39
I think there’s, there’s a lot of moments for somatics is so slow.
22:43
Like in general, you know, we’ve done sessions together, I’ve done sessions with other people and I’m like barely doing anything.
22:51
And it’s wild how like the smallest movement, the smallest, like little shape or whatever I end up stepping into creates a crazy amount of emotion, a crazy amount of moment and things just start flowing.
23:06
But that’s what I love about somatics.
23:08
I think people, it’s hard.
23:10
It’s, I also want to go to the other side because a lot of people want extreme.
23:13
A lot of people want it to be done quickly.
23:14
They want to be asked it.
23:16
There’s a lot of patience in it, but there’s a reason why you’re talking to that.
23:19
Right.
23:19
It’s important to go slow for your system.
23:22
Yes.
23:23
Yeah.
23:23
Yeah.
23:24
Yeah.
23:24
Because otherwise what happens is you end up risking potential re traumatization.
23:29
Right.
23:29
Right.
23:30
Where we’re just going into cycles of catharsis, but there’s not actually any room for renegotiation or for integration or for the system to actually fully come out.
23:40
And you know, this is why like I personally my own personal belief, like I don’t necessarily like think that that’s the best way to go about it.
23:46
I think some catharsis is great occasionally, but we also want to make sure that there’s just as much if not more geared towards actually supporting somebody integrate back into their body and back into the life and then into the world.
24:00
Yeah.
24:00
But so as someone wants to, let’s say they start to feel a lot of frustration, they start to feel a lot of anger they witness like, oh my gosh, I’m really angry.
24:09
I can feel that in my body.
24:11
What can someone start doing to like inviting that or, or process it and what are the some of the containers or tools that can help someone do that?
24:21
And then also I’ll also say like if you are processing really heavy trauma work with a practitioner to hold you in that.
24:27
Who would love your take?
24:28
Yeah, definitely hitting on that caveat.
24:31
There’s like a balance.
24:32
Yeah.
24:32
Yeah.
24:33
Yeah.
24:35
What, what I’ll say before I go into this is at any time something starts to feel really intense to where all you can feel is what you’re feeling or with somebody who’s trained in, in, in the work because can be really challenging to hold or coach ourselves in those moments.
24:55
And especially if you’re working with stuff that has never actually had space to be processed or aired or add the support.
25:03
So that’s what I would say.
25:04
And then nearly on the other side of that, like you don’t want to push yourself.
25:07
This is not about get angry and yell at the world.
25:11
That’s not what we’re trying to do either.
25:12
What we’re working with is how do we start to feel safe?
25:16
Feeling what we’re feeling and being with it?
25:20
And gosh, there’s so much that I want to say here.
25:23
The first thing that I would say is if you’ve been on one end of the spectrum where you’ve grown up in an environment that was emotionally volatile, just a lot of intensity around you and you have a lot of aversion to feeling your frustration or anger or rage or just it feels hard to access.
25:42
There’s a lot of fear or uncertainty around it or a lot of hesitation around the impact on others definitely work with somebody.
25:51
But more importantly, the, the first part of this is recognizing that you get to feel that because a lot of the times what comes up is we feel a lot of shame and we feel a lot of guilt.
26:02
So we have to work with the, the complexity of, of the other feelings that are here before we can actually work with the anchor in the ra, right?
26:11
And so part of this and it happens really quick in sessions as well where sometimes, you know, we’ll, we’ll start to tap into something and somebody will say, like, I feel really annoyed with, I’m like, OK, let’s, let’s sit with that for a moment.
26:24
Can you notice, notice where you’re feeling really annoyed right now, really agitated and then they’ll, you know, the notice that and they’ll start to track that and say, ok, noticing that there’s a lot more rigidity showing up, right?
26:35
So if the defense pattern has always been to shut it down, what you’re gonna start to see if you’re watching the video version of this and you’re gonna start to see is the person is gonna start to get more stiff, they’re gonna start to become less mobile, they’re gonna start moving less and you know, they’re, they’re gonna say, I feel angry and then what will happen?
26:52
A lot of times when we’re working with systems who go into states of repression is they’ll, they’ll freeze.
26:58
So the rigidity is coming online because the system is shutting it down because it doesn’t feel like it’s appropriate or safe to bring it out.
27:04
Right.
27:05
So, we’ll, there, we’ll work with it, we’ll work with.
27:07
Ok.
27:07
So if you can just wiggle a toe, wiggle a finger, right.
27:10
Let’s see if we can just move the eyes a little bit and let’s start to work with the neck and then we’ll work with different sounds and help the system slowly start to recognize like, hey, you can move your body, you’re here, there’s a body here, right?
27:23
And as we start to do that, then you notice the shoulders and the arms and everything starts to come down, there’s more space in, in the breath and in the belly and there’s also gonna be a lot more warmth.
27:35
So what we’re tracking for easy things, hot, cold and is breathing easy, hard, shallow, deep.
27:44
And do you feel like there’s more space or like it’s more tight, right?
27:48
More relaxed or more tight.
27:50
And so as we start to come out of the freeze with this, then we’ll start to notice like, OK, what else is here?
27:56
And a lot of the times this is where we start to see a lot of over coupling or under coupling with other emotions.
28:01
So things like the shame might come up, things like the guilt might come up a lot of the times, especially if there’s environments where we, had other folks who were really intense or loud or aggressive around us.
28:13
There’s terror, there’s fear here, right?
28:17
This is really, really important to work with because if that is there, we want to work with the fear.
28:22
We want to work with the terror and help this person start to orient to.
28:26
Hey, how like, can you see me?
28:28
How do you know that you’re safe right now?
28:30
Notice where you are, notice what day it is?
28:33
What year it is?
28:34
What’s your name?
28:35
Where are we?
28:36
Because again, when you’re starting to work with his star, it’s not something that happens fast.
28:42
There’s a lot of tracking that you need to do to make sure somebody is still here and not completely in a response.
28:48
And as they start to, to come out of some of that fear, the next part of this is recognizing where the anger is and this is what you’re asking this way to get here.
28:58
But I think you highlight that there’s so many layers.
29:01
Yeah.
29:01
Yeah.
29:01
And I think that’s one of the beautiful things about se I and somatics and this whole process you’re talking to, it’s like layer by layer by layer by layer because because of an experience, we end up creating these other ways to like protect and manage ourselves and all these things you have to go through each of those one by one.
29:19
You can’t just go directly to the thing without being with all the others.
29:23
Right?
29:24
100%.
29:25
100%.
29:25
Yeah.
29:26
Yeah.
29:26
And I wouldn’t say when you, when you finally got to the space, yeah, when you get there, when you finally get there, it might be, it might be mud swipe years.
29:35
But when you get there, it is a very interesting process.
29:39
And the reason why I say that is because you can show up in different ways, depending again on, on the system and the history and, and how the defense systems were developed.
29:50
Directionality.
29:52
It is also something to look at because there’s, there’s inner, inward directed anger, meaning when you are, when you have feel like you have no sense of control at the world outside of you.
30:03
So what do you do?
30:04
You become so angry with yourself.
30:06
And this is where we start to see things as far as etymology like self harm.
30:10
And this can show up in a, in a multitude of way.
30:12
I’d say this can show up in alcohol addiction, drugs, sex, risky decision making, gambling, self harm, right?
30:19
A lot of really, really heavy topics where we take it out on ourselves.
30:24
And when you’re working with something like this, it’s a really delicate process of helping somebody start to feel like they can actually turn that out, right?
30:37
Because the reason why we don’t want to feel it is because we feel like we’re going to destroy ourselves.
30:40
And that can feel really, really scary and overwhelming, which is why we don’t want to go directly into it and feel it as intensely as possible when we start to work with these things because we don’t want somebody to regress into a state of self harm if they have a history of self harm or, you know, whatever the, the history is.
30:55
So, what we want to do with this person is we want to very, very slowly in a very titrated place and by titrated,, you can think of this kind of like if you have a fire hose, we don’t want to open up the fire hose.
31:07
We want it very, very slowly.
31:09
Just, just a wee bit or, or a soda can, might, might be easier if we, to think of it like a giant Coke bottle that you’ve just shaken up.
31:15
Right.
31:15
We don’t wanna just like, or it’s gonna hit you in the Yeah.
31:18
Yeah, we don’t want to just, like, open it all the way up.
31:21
We want to slowly just, just a tiny bit, let it diffuse and then just a tiny bit because that’s kind of what we’re doing here.
31:27
You’ve got all of this built up survival energy that’s stuck in the system and all of this things.
31:32
And all of these, these are not easy emotions to work with and we have to know how to, how to slowly work with it because the other part of this is if you have somebody who has a defense pattern of feeling like they’re too much.
31:44
So they hold it in, you gotta be ready to work with that because if they start to feel like they’re too intense for the space that they’re in, that can also be really challenging to deal with.
31:55
Which is why when you’re doing this work, you really want to make sure you’re vetting the people that you’re doing this work with and that they have the capacity to support you on these deeper types of things.
32:05
Now, when we’re working with internalized anger and internalized rage, these are things like feeling existential, like an existential crisis or terror or disgust either for yourself or the world or both can feel very all encompassing.
32:24
And when you get into these states can almost feel like the way that the system is responding is if I can destroy myself, nobody else can destroy me.
32:34
It’s a way in which the system is protecting in a really interesting space because it feels like it has no control on the external environment.
32:43
So what does it do?
32:44
It harms itself so much to where nothing anybody else does could possibly compare to the pain that you’re giving yourself.
32:51
And I’m just gonna invite y’all to, you know, take some, take some deep breaths and look around a little bit after getting into it, I’ll shake it out like, yeah, yeah, because they’re gonna get a sort of things, definitely feel it like, even when you were talking about like the intent, like, oh, here we go.
33:05
It’s up, you know.
33:06
No.
33:06
You know.
33:07
So.
33:07
Yeah.
33:08
Yeah.
33:08
Yeah.
33:09
So, you know, just we go over the toes, look around a little bit because this, these are not easy conversations or easy topics to go into and it can bring up a lot of, a lot of things for a lot of different folks.
33:20
But it’s, you know, it’s important that we’re able to identify these things because a lot of the times we’re told that we just need to meditate and nothing about it.
33:29
I was definitely not that too, you know, like I feel like what we’re having is such an important conversation around the importance of giving it how important it is because, you know, when you see things on Instagram or you see people showing people how to process anger and like they’re like, be with your anger and people were like slamming like their pillow on the bed and things like that.
33:49
Like, yes, that is so helpful to be a representation of like this is kind of welcome.
33:53
I get that part, but there’s all this other fluff and this importance of being actually nurtured and cared for and held in that experience and knowing, you know, what your boundaries are in that process, you know, what are your actual edges in that process?
34:10
Like you said, like, you can definitely create more harm than good if you go into it from places like, not really knowing your system or have had work that done the work with someone that can identify that, you know?
34:24
Yeah.
34:25
And I, I, you know, I’ll give you some examples here because life is so fun.
34:29
, I had, before I got to the trauma work, I, and before I got pregnant I didn’t know I was pregnant at the time I was in a breathwork certification program.
34:38
And,, we would go into these breathwork practices and I would go into full blown catharsis every single time.
34:44
And you know, that everybody wanted to, to work on my system because, you know, it’s like fireworks and everything.
34:51
But no, like I felt so disoriented after every single time that I did that, even though they were like these huge big releases because I wasn’t actually fully there.
35:01
I wasn’t fully in my body as I was navigating that I was very much so like in a complete state of, of catharsis.
35:09
And when I first started going into se work, I had a really interesting experience, beginning one, the first, the first training of my first year in se a really interesting experience with a woman who, and I, I didn’t realize at the time when I got into the training that we were gonna be practicing on each other and that meant that people were going to be working on me with my trauma, very un aware of that.
35:34
So just heads up for anyone considering and there was somebody who, you know, came in and, and we were partnered together.
35:41
And luckily, you know, there were, there were plenty of faculty there supporting and so we had plenty of eyeballs on us.
35:47
One of the things that I really, really appreciated about that program and this woman was just so unaware of what was going on with me.
35:56
She was trying to work with me and the the mis atonement was something that, that is very familiar for my system, right?
36:04
When, when it feels like there’s not like a respect in the boundary that’s there.
36:08
And for me with my system, the way that that shows up is when somebody is digging and I don’t want them to dig.
36:15
But at the time, I didn’t have the capacity to be like, no, I didn’t know how to do that.
36:22
So it is fair that you say no, right?
36:24
Like, yeah, I didn’t, I didn’t, I didn’t know that back then.
36:29
Yeah.
36:30
Yeah, I didn’t know that back then.
36:32
And so my my defense pattern was to go inward.
36:37
And so for those of you watching the video, it was very much like every part of me was tensing and every part of me was like, like there was just such like an air in a rage directed outward, but also inward and just like taking it, right?
36:53
Just like taking it because that was the way that up until then I had dealt with life, she was to tense up and take it.
37:03
No, it’s been really sorry.
37:05
Yeah.
37:06
How many of us are just tensing up and taking it, you know?
37:12
Yeah.
37:13
So, but it’s none of that.
37:14
Not the fact that it is.
37:15
It’s crazy that we do do that, you know.
37:18
Yeah.
37:18
Yeah, 100%.
37:19
And, you know, I got the one or the other faculty member.
37:22
Luckily at the time, the time wore out this person never really got anywhere with me.
37:26
And we were asked, you know, like, how was that for?
37:30
And I just started bawling and was just like outraged.
37:35
I was like, I have never felt so mis attuned in my entire life.
37:40
Like I felt so unsafe in the fact that you weren’t even like, I was angry at this person for not even being aware of how uncomfortable and unsafe I felt and how vulnerable and exposed it.
37:50
I felt the point in sharing all of that is coming back to the conversation of how we work with folks in these places and in these species because what I needed at the time when I first started doing this work because my system though is very intense also has a really hard time vocalizing outwardly what I’m feeling and study and holding a boundary and took a while to get to that place three fucking years to get to that place.
38:20
But in my final training, there was, there’s, there’s a lot that had happened to keep, you know, story short and, and to not demonstrate growth, a different woman, a different woman had gotten really upset at something that I had said in inside of the group setting of about a room of about maybe 100 students are advanced.
38:42
Your final training, there was a bit of an uproar and anti racism and adversity, equity conversations and just a very VUN practitioner.
38:52
And I spoke up about it and I made some comments and this person felt like I was thinking directly about them.
38:59
And in one of the group settings, they decided to, you know, like when I, when I get angry, when I get upset, I’ve learned how to hold that intensity within myself.
39:11
And, and so I was disengaged from the conversation until this woman looks at me and says directly to me that she felt like I was speaking directly to her.
39:19
And if I had something to say that I could say it to her.
39:22
Faith.
39:24
Yeah.
39:24
Yeah.
39:25
Yeah.
39:25
Say how did you navigate that?
39:29
Oh, it was fun.
39:30
Yeah.
39:31
So as you can see right now, there’s a lot happening in my system.
39:34
Yeah, I was like, are you OK?
39:36
Do you wanna, you wanna shake it out a little?
39:39
No, it’s good.
39:40
It’s good.
39:41
But yeah, it was a very similar response, right?
39:43
There was almost just like this sense of like, oh, you don’t know what you’re doing because one of the things that I’ve developed a relationship with over the years was recognizing how much power I actually do have.
39:57
And I don’t say that in like a woo woo way.
39:59
I say that in a sense of like, if I needed to do something incredibly volatile and violent to protect myself, I know that I would be able to do that.
40:08
Right.
40:08
And that’s an innate thing for any living animal is if we’re being threatened, knowing how to actually access and get in touch with that type of fight response within yourself is 100 and 10% necessary for your survival.
40:24
And I didn’t have access to that for a very long time because I didn’t think it was safe.
40:29
Right.
40:30
I, I was on the receiving end of a lot of that for a lot of my life.
40:34
And so I didn’t have a healthy relationship to it.
40:37
I was terrified of it.
40:38
And after working through all of that, when this woman came up and confronted me in that way, it was very much the conversation of, you know, this isn’t my responsibility, like what you’re feeling is not mine.
40:48
And I’m not going to sit here and subject myself to your fragility and continue to hear this conversation.
40:54
So if you want to process that you can process it with somebody else, but that’s not mine.
40:59
And I was able to stand up and actually walk away and leave the room and say no and hold a boundary.
41:05
Right.
41:06
Yeah.
41:06
Up until that point, maybe, no, it wasn’t like a 180.
41:10
It was, it was a very slow progression.
41:12
But had that been, you know, happening in the first year, I would have never been able to, I would have just taken it and I probably would have never said anything in the first place to get myself into that predicament.
41:23
But on the other end of that, it was a, it was a progression of recognizing like I could annihilate this person.
41:29
And this is where we’re starting to talk about other side of working with anger and aggression.
41:32
And what that actually looks like when you start to develop capacity to, to work with it and be with it is I actually have capacity to annihilate somebody if I really wanted to or need it to and I can work with it.
41:45
I can hold that intensity.
41:46
I can bring that up and be here in it without acting on it.
41:50
And that’s what we’re starting to talk about developing healthy, healthy aggression, healthy range because I think what a lot of folks maybe misunderstand about these types of feelings or expressions.
42:02
It’s not about not having it, not feeling, not being in the intensity of it.
42:07
It’s not about downplay.
42:10
Yeah, it’s about how can you actually hold that and have range and fluidity in your expression.
42:16
To where if I need to access that part of myself, I am able to get into it and be with it, but I’m also able to come out of it.
42:24
And I think that’s a really important, key distinction is a lot of the times on the other extreme of this, you know, we spend a lot of time talking about folks who have a hard time accessing anger or frustration or rage.
42:35
But on the other side of that, there’s folks who live in a constant state of anger and rage.
42:40
So we, we don’t want to get stuck in that place either where we feel like all we’re doing is fighting the world because that’s exhausting.
42:48
It’s perpetually exhausting.
42:50
So we want to, to work within it in a place to where I can touch into an access and be with the intensity of my experience and feel this and know that I can handle it and I can manage it.
43:00
And if I need to, I can destroy something or someone, but I know that I won’t because I have control over that.
43:09
And you and you find ways to start to learn how to communicate and externalize that, right?
43:14
So we were, we were talking a little bit earlier about some clients who have a really hard time Externalizing or communicating their frustration to rage because they don’t know how to do it in a, in a healthy and productive way, right?
43:25
Without going into a state of, you know, seeing red and, and like, I’m gonna kill you and I’m gonna come at you kind of anger, like I’m gonna throw every mean thing I know in the book at you.
43:37
Yeah, I think.
43:38
Yeah.
43:39
Yeah, exactly.
43:40
That, and part of that is, is that we don’t know how to hold that intensity without losing ourselves in it.
43:46
Right.
43:46
So, it’s, it’s, how can I be with the intensity of what I’m feeling right now, be direct and hold a boundary and communicate this boundary without completely trying to destroy the other person that’s in front of me.
43:58
Is that, that is a very, very delicate dance totally.
44:03
I mean, I talk about communications by jam like I love that.
44:06
But a lot of the questions that I get are like, what if someone comes at me hard?
44:10
You know, how do I stand in my boundary?
44:12
How do I stay true to my and you can fall into the place of getting defensive and coming at them too?
44:18
Or you can learn how to be with your experience and still make like, respectfully, I don’t know what the right word is but like grounded, respectfully say this is not mine.
44:28
I’m going to take myself out of the situation and it sounds like that you did that so person so beautifully and you know, you knew that that was their responsibility.
44:36
And I think that’s the other thing that is such a beautiful gift that you know that she’s going through her process and that you don’t have the capacity to meet her in the process or have her navigate that process.
44:45
Like you were like, no, this is not for me and that’s well done while you’re also having this crazy internal experience, which can feel like a lot.
44:55
And I think that’s the part that I think is so beautiful.
44:58
It’s not that anger like you’re saying, you don’t have to explode on someone.
45:02
Don’t, don’t go off like do, don’t destroying things and being like, I’m going to be angry because I’ve suppressed my anger my whole life and I’m going to start biting it.
45:12
That’s when you’re regressing into like age three.
45:14
And that’s what my toddler is currently working with right now because like he gets angry and he’s like, it’s really cute.
45:20
He was like, you know, like full blown and it’s funny because, you know, I, I see this in sessions with clients with him.
45:30
It’s cute because I could be like the Daniel, the Tiger, however it goes Tiger, Daniel, whatever his name is.
45:36
There’s a cute little song.
45:38
Yeah, that we sing now and it goes when you feel so mad that you wanna roar, take a deep breath and go to court and it works when he’s not angry.
45:50
But what are you saying about?
45:51
It was like the one that is angry though, like they get in that, you know, what I mean, like you have to meet them, you have to meet them in it and you have to meet them in a way to where you can match the intensity but not, not necessarily the emotion.
46:04
Like you’re not coming at them, you’re able to meet them and help them feel contained in it.
46:08
Because when you’re working with something as big as intense as anger or hatred or rage or discussed, whether it’s inward or outward, you have to have a container that can hold that right?
46:20
My son’s a great example of this because when he gets angry and he has tantrums, he has tantrums, right?
46:25
You know, it’s not all the time but really in my work at alphabet over here, it’s, it’s being with him in that and saying like, no, you cannot hit me.
46:34
I love you and I’m here for you and I’m gonna be here with you.
46:37
But no, like you’re not going to hurt me.
46:40
No, I love you.
46:41
I’m here with you.
46:42
Understand that this is a really big emotion and that this is probably really overwhelming and really hard to navigate right now and I’m right here, I’m right here and a lot of the times go ahead.
46:53
I say you can feel that in your presence right now.
46:55
Yeah, they like it wasn’t like I’m screaming at you or it wasn’t like it’s OK, you know, you know, like the, there’s like this sense of like, I meet you on the structure.
47:05
I hold you, I guide you.
47:07
You’re safe.
47:07
It’s ok.
47:09
Yeah.
47:09
Yeah, because we, we don’t, we, often times, like, never had that experience, you know, it’s, it’s very rare might be biased because again, this is all, all the work that I do.
47:20
So, of course, the people I meet are the people who haven’t done it.
47:22
, but, but it’s very rare that we actually have had that upbringing to where that was what we got.
47:29
You know, it’s funny, I, I share these stories with my clients a lot of the time and they’re like that, that would be so amazing.
47:33
Like if that’s actually, oh my God, that was in real life for me either.
47:37
I mean, this is a part of what I’m so grateful.
47:39
I don’t know if it’s just our generation.
47:40
I mean, that has been for a long around, for a really long time.
47:43
Right.
47:43
This, this work has been going on for a while.
47:46
I think more people are finding it and now we have tools like I would have never known like if someone’s angry like to meet them and not if anything, I’m like, I mean, the old, still parts of me, you know, still something I work on would be like, oh scared, I’m gonna leave them alone, I’m gonna step away.
48:02
You’re gonna handle this on your own.
48:03
You know, because I had no sense of capacity to hold that.
48:08
But I also did not have the skill set or if someone didn’t teach me to be like, no, in those educations, someone actually needs to be held in that to like, really be met in that and, you know, meeting it with a sense of how do I say, like, really deep, like I’m here, you know, like, yes, but no one taught me that and it makes me mad and I’m also so grateful for like, wow, because I don’t have, you know, I talk about anger because I’m like getting angry that I don’t know how to process anger.
48:39
Just kidding.
48:40
You know, always a start.
48:42
But, you know, now being able to step into that, you know, it’s just what you just talked about is just so beautiful and like holding that structure, especially if your son and imagine if more people did that for people.
48:54
Yeah.
48:55
I mean, it’s again like, I’m not perfect.
48:57
I have my moments.
48:59
Yes, same.
49:01
I’m like, I’m fucking done today.
49:02
Catch go talk to your dad.
49:05
I’m at my capacity.
49:06
I I’m at my limit that you need to go fucking to your mom.
49:11
Can you take him?
49:12
That’s what I’m, I’m gonna lose my shit, you know.
49:15
But like that’s, that’s the beauty of it.
49:17
And, and I wanna say to, you know, to any parents or, or folks listening who have whatever the experiences are.
49:23
It’s not about never having ruptures in your relationships.
49:27
I think that’s a, a big misconception is this idea that we’re never gonna have conflict or ruptures or mis atonement.
49:35
Those things are inevitable, they’re going to happen.
49:37
The healing happens in the repair and that’s the magic like I have moments where, you know, I fuck up as a parent where I’m just, you know, I don’t have the capacity that day.
49:47
I feel overwhelmed, over stimulated this weekend was really overstimulating and that’s gonna happen, that’s normal.
49:53
So I think part of this is being kind to yourself and compassionate with yourself that you’re not expected to be a perfect human being in this process.
49:59
But also to recognize like there’s more power in the repair after a rupture than completely avoiding rupture altogether, which is where we get into a whole different subject of, you know, trauma with.
50:11
Do you want to stay on record another episode?
50:14
Because it’s a whole another thing, the whole another topic on the other end of this with neglect, that’s not neglect, but it’s a different kind of neglect.
50:23
So neglect is, you know, absence of.
50:24
And then the other part of that is the overbearing parent who, you know, is, is just so passive in, in the approach or the, you know, the upbringing is so passive that there was never any structure, never anything that was like really there, it was just like whatever you want.
50:38
But at the same time like that never, it never got to be held or met,, you know, who talks about this so well, what’s her name?
50:45
The two books called Running On MD.
50:47
Yeah.
50:47
Yeah.
50:48
What’s her name?
50:49
But the bug.
50:50
Yeah, I need to find the bug but she’s a psychologist that literally just talks so much about missing up the neglect of like, not really receiving what you actually need.
50:59
So, like in moments of like, oh, I want to, in that moment I wanted to be held.
51:04
But my, the person that I was with didn’t know that I needed to be held, but it’s still damaging to my system because I so badly needed to be held or be emotionally seen.
51:12
But like, they didn’t recognize I needed to be emotionally seen.
51:15
She talks about that so beautifully in that book.
51:17
And there’s two books.
51:18
One is the identifying and the two is like, how to actually like navigate that and integrate that into your life.
51:24
So it’s really good.
51:25
Yeah.
51:26
Yeah.
51:26
Yeah, I know the book.
51:27
That’s a good one.
51:28
I don’t remember the author’s name though.
51:29
Sorry.
51:29
She’s a, she’s a psychologist edit it in.
51:32
We’ll find the name and then you can come back and say it like here you go back.
51:36
Wait, I guess for my last like couple like my last question, you know, especially because we’re still tapping on like anger and rage.
51:43
I’m so glad that we like talked about like the different dynamics of it, the layers of it because there’s so much more than just anger.
51:51
There’s so much more than just frustration.
51:52
There’s, and like, how it can be born and, like, what the steps are and, like, how to be held on that.
51:57
, but if you could, if there is any right, like next step would be the very, very first step to this whole process and wanting to be with the anger.
52:10
I think we’ve talked so much about the game profession, how to do that.
52:12
But like, how can someone just start to invite the process of it?
52:17
He has, it’s tricky, it’s tricky, right?
52:19
Because there’s like, depending on where you’re at and where you’re starting from, the, the answer is different.
52:23
And I think that’s part of the reason, like, why personally, like, I don’t know if it ever do group work in this, in this regard because it’s so individualized that it’s really hard to be like, here’s your blueprint for doing this because I don’t know what’s going to come up.
52:36
Like I had a client where I recommended her for her, excuse me, for them to do something.
52:41
And, you know, I thought it was a good idea at the time and then they did it and then, and then things just started to happen and I was like, oh shit, where did we just go?
52:51
We had to come out of that because it brought up so much other content for them.
52:55
So I, I’m really cautious to say you know, here’s the blueprint or here’s the step by step or, or here’s the protocol because every single person’s system, upbringing in history and, and trauma background is so different and something that might be helpful and resourceful for, for one person in this example, could be incredibly harmful and traumatizing for another person.
53:19
So I think that the best thing that you can do in this is start to get support around better understanding yourself and how you show up and how you navigate life.
53:32
And just starting to take note of what are the things that bring things up for you is probably the first stop and just starting to, to develop the awareness of those pieces and how that feels and what that looks like in your system.
53:46
And for folks who’ve never done any of this kind of work, what is it called?
53:50
There’s a, there’s a chart or wheel of sensation and to help you better orient to like the different types of sensations and emotions within your body.
53:59
I sure we’ll link it in the resources along with the book.
54:02
All right.
54:03
So taking those.
54:04
Yeah.
54:04
Yeah.
54:05
But there, there’s a wheel that, that helps you better understand range of capacity of different sensations and emotions and, and just starting to develop a relationship with that, like can you actually feel your butt on the chair right now?
54:17
Wherever you’re sitting or laying or can you feel your feet on the floor?
54:20
Like, are you noticing that these things, are there?
54:22
Do you feel warm or hot?
54:23
Do different parts of your bodies feel different temperatures?
54:25
Do you feel soft or hard or you can start with broader, more general pieces so that you can track those, the easiest things to attuned to or orient words or become aware of and depending on your language is soft and hard, it’s really easy to track hot and cold, really easy to track and your breath and then your eyes right?
54:45
Noticing like, do I, do I feel like I have a really intense stare?
54:49
Do I feel like I’m more relaxed in my face?
54:51
Do I feel more relaxed in my body?
54:52
Does my belly feel more like big and open or does it feel more tight and contracted?
54:57
These are things that anybody at, at any level will be able to start to feel?
55:02
And then as you do the work, as you start to go deeper into it, you’ll, you’ll develop more language and and more understanding of the nuances of these things.
55:10
So you’re like, oh, this feels like this and that.
55:13
Let me start to get into some fun stuff, but that’s where I would start.
55:16
I would say starting to get curious about yourself noticing for you where you fit on that spectrum.
55:23
And it might be something that we didn’t even talk about today because today we were very much focused on, on the suppression and inability to access just one end of the spectrum and there’s a lot of layers inside of that as, you know, we’ve kind of gone over the other end of the spectrum.
55:39
You know, if you’re somebody who, who feels angry or feels like, you know, there’s just so much in you, then that’s a totally different conversation.
55:46
You wanna identify that.
55:47
But I would say starting there just getting curious about where you are and then getting the proper support especially.
55:53
And again, you don’t have to have a history of severe trauma for the symptomology to be there.
55:59
If you’re noticing that you have a hard time speaking up for yourself.
56:02
If you’re noticing that it’s hard for you to hold a boundary or express your needs or ask for what you want or have really difficult, hard conversations or whatever it might be.
56:13
These are things to explore and look at because it doesn’t have to just be extremes we’re working with.
56:19
It can be even in the subtleties as well.
56:22
100%.
56:22
I mean, you gave them such a beautiful gift of just becoming aware of their body and like what’s actually happening, right?
56:29
Just starting right there.
56:31
And that is something that you don’t have to just do when you’re angry, right?
56:35
Like you can do that any time of the day, like really noticing how your body feels when you’re relaxed.
56:40
How does your body feel when you’re happy?
56:42
How does your body feel when you’re sad, how does it feel when it’s stressed?
56:45
You know, there’s all the different states can definitely take away from that practice you shared.
56:50
And then also, I think, especially with the podcasts and everyone that’s listening, like I think my goal is to kind of normalize emotions and expression, you know, like expressing emotions and being with them and then also just creating capacity to be with them.
57:05
Like, it’s not so much about suppressing that and like you said, or like putting them aside, I mean, like that’s underneath the rug for the next 20 years, then we’re going to talk about it again or I’m gonna pray to God that is never going to come up again.
57:16
Like, sorry, it is, you know, like that, that’s really like the goal I think Bernie anyone that’s listening to is just like normalizing these conversations and being like, it’s OK that you feel these things and you know, you can also look for support, like really, really stepping into that because I think for me personally and I be able to move through anger and rage and learn how to process it in a very healthy way and be held in that has created so much more capacity to be with things.
57:45
And in the middle of hard conversations in the, in the middle of like work going bonkers and like having to troubleshoot, you know, like just any kind of momentum like that, you’re like Wow, I can actually be with this experience without my emotion, completely taking over of the experience, which is another thing we talked about, you know.
58:02
So, yeah, with that being said, I just want to say thank you so so much for coming onto the Blade for podcast and like truly talking about this and I would love for you to share, you know, a little bit more.
58:16
Obviously, we’ll tie a lot of resources that maybe someone can do a couple of links to like back to you.
58:21
But if you’re open to sharing, like how you actually support clients, what does that mean?
58:26
What are you called?
58:27
And how can someone contact you?
58:29
Yeah, so there’s, there’s an entire page on my site, the customer.com/trauma dash, whatever the little line thing is coaching.
58:39
And I have a private practice very different from most of the industry.
58:44
If you’re in the coaching world, the way that I operate is I do ad hoc sessions because I find that it’s actually the most appropriate for this work and I do sliding scale.
58:52
So what that means is there’s no applications or pre qualifications in place because I get that it happens.
58:57
Life happens.
58:58
You don’t need to sit here and tell me why you feel like you need to have a sliding scale price.
59:03
It’s all there folks can just book whenever they need or want for new clients.
59:07
I do take them through intake process because I need to know and understand your, your background and your history and the the word or the title would be a Somatic Experiencing Practitioner and SEP as well as training in neuro effective touch.
59:23
So I do integrate a lot of touch work.
59:26
We didn’t really get into much of this today, but a lot of my background is also in early developmental trauma.
59:31
So my specialties are around early developmental trauma, a lot around raids, around a lot around neglect and a lot around adverse childhood experiences.
59:41
So I I tend to work more on the extreme ends.
59:44
And then the, the things that I will say here is for folks who have more severe symptomology and I would be referring out.
59:52
So if you have something that’s more severe, like suicidal ideation, I would work with you, but only places where you are also working with somebody who’s a licensed clinical psychologist or therapist to help monitor cases because I’m not licensed in that regard.
1:00:07
And I think that’s important to, to mention.
1:00:09
So that that would be the one thing that, you know, you can find that on the site or anyone that’s curious or interested, there’s also a ton of resources on there.
1:00:16
If you just go to the blog or the podcast, there’s just plenty of stuff that you can explore and dive into depending on what you’re looking for and what you need.
1:00:24
But yeah, I think this is a a good little entry point.
1:00:27
Yeah, that was so beautifully said.
1:00:29
And I think, you know, I personally done sessions with you and I always felt so safe and they were always when I needed.
1:00:37
And so I truly love the ad hoc model because at least personally, for me, you know, I’m in a place right now where like, not a lot of things are coming up.
1:00:43
But like, when I know I really want to reach out and like, wanna be with that and like really taking that responsibility for my healing and my process is really cool.
1:00:51
As well as, yeah, you’re just an amazing practitioner and it, you guys didn’t take away, she knows a lot, you know, and I love that for the sessions, you know, like I come into your sessions and you’re teaching me too, you know, and I think it’s also really important to take that away if, if someone ever wants that space too.
1:01:08
So, and all right, ladies, if you are listening in, this is for you, if you have a friend or family member that is female, that is looking for community that is looking at this path of growth and wanting to evolve as a human being, please listen in.
1:01:27
So I wanna share with you the fully expressed community.
1:01:30
If you haven’t heard about it, you need to hear about it and you’re hearing about it today and I’d love for you to check it out.
1:01:36
The fully expressed community is for women supporting women.
1:01:40
We have created a community where you can connect with other women that are also on this path of growth that are interested and curious about what else is available to them.
1:01:50
They want to see themselves living a life they expressed in their lives and their relationships and their business.
1:01:55
They wanna bring their fully authentic self into all areas of their life.
1:02:00
So they can actually attract a life and relationships and careers and business that is so aligned to them because they are living a life fully expressed in the fully expressed community.
1:02:11
We meet online every single second Wednesday of every single month at 5:30 p.m. PST and also have access to a Slack channel where I drop resources where we share information, we talk about the community, we create community.
1:02:26
You also get access to not only the guest coaches that have been on this podcast, but also guest coaches that I have kept waiting to show you what they have to share with you when it comes to their teachings and their practitioners.
1:02:38
And they’re only gonna listen from me, but you’re also gonna learn from these amazing human beings that are available to you out there and here to share their gifts with you so that you can live a life fully expressed.
1:02:49
The fully expressed community is only $27 a month.
1:02:52
And if you leave a review on this podcast I will actually give to you one month to come join us for free in the fully expressed community to actually experience what it means to be in this community and these women.
1:03:06
So if you go leave a review for me, I’ll go do that.
1:03:09
You could also find more information in the show notes about the fully expressed community.
1:03:13
And I hope to see you there next month, the next second Wednesday that is available to you to be surrounded by other women that just freaking get it, that just get what you’re going through.
1:03:24
I’ll see you there.
1:03:26
I love the fact that you also refer out.
1:03:28
I think it’s so in t in integrity and I think the coaching industry really needs a lot of integrity podcast.
1:03:39
Sorry.
1:03:40
No.
1:03:41
Anyways and you know, yeah, I think we just need, even though it’s really hard to find really good practitioners that are in a space of integrity and are practicing in their lanes because some of this stuff can get really gray and defining that for yourself as a practitioner or even knowing how to identify that as a client is difficult.
1:04:00
I just, I love that you are already living in that.
1:04:03
So I appreciate you so much.
1:04:05
Thank you so much for coming on.
1:04:07
You know, thanks for having me.
1:04:08
I’m glad we got to jump out and all the things.
1:04:11
Yeah, I feel like we could jam for, for days.
1:04:13
All right.
1:04:14
Yeah.
1:04:15
Literally.
1:04:17
So yay.
